Why The Hate of Backdoor?

[PopeMobile]

I think I was pretty clear delineating the difference between a counterfeit and a backdoor.

[GotFrank]

I think I was pretty clear delineating the difference between a counterfeit and a backdoor.

And I'd say you were for the most part with the exception of all the NHL shirts & handbags stuff. That was all a non sequitur.

I'm not here to say what's right & wrong in China. I figure it's best Left up to the Chinese.
And if Mattel doesn't like it they can take their business elsewhere I'm sure. So on the moral side you've derived a conclusion without all the facts. And that's your choice. But clearly everyone has their own opinions. Or some may have never tried to come to one without all the facts.

[PopeMobile]

I used the example of the DVDs, handbags, and NHL jerseys to show a pattern of repeated proliferation of counterfeit goods coming out of China. So it should be no surprise to anyone that the same thing can and does happen in Mattel factories in China with the Apple car, Red Ransburg, Tach-o-Mint, etc. So with the counterfeiting taking place it is not a big stretch to conclude that product running out the backdoor is stolen.

[GotFrank]

Your choice to stretch it...

And the Red Ranburgs & Tach-O-Mints are factory made. Therefore referred to in the collector's community as (long before you came along with your opinions) "factory customs" . As they show clear evidence they were used using the same materials as the retail Cars.

"Stolen" from whom?

[Fillmore1234]

Somebody needs to get lovemini's attention on this matter and see what he has to say about it, before this turns into a bigger argument than it already is.

But I will say that Mattel has got to know something about how there have always been backdoor Cars leaking out from China. If it was actually 'stealing', then Mattel would have fixed that problem a long time ago. Or maybe they care about this subject just as much as they care about proper case assortment, case distribution, successful marketing (Kmart events), and the collectors of the line in general.

Although this is a pointless paragraph in relation to the rest of the discussion, but do take account of how since the first 4 Cars Take Flight Cars were made in Thailand, nobody knew about them until they were actually released. The Nasca Truck, however, was made in China and was already leaked by mydogcallzero months before the Take Flight line was released. So that means that there are either no Cars backdoor buyers in Thailand or there are a few more locks on the Thailand backdoor than on China's.

[carslover]

Somebody needs to get lovemini's attention on this matter and see what he has to say about it, before this turns into a bigger argument than it already is.

But I will say that Mattel has got to know something about how there have always been backdoor Cars leaking out from China. If it was actually 'stealing', then Mattel would have fixed that problem a long time ago. Or maybe they care about this subject just as much as they care about proper case assortment, case distribution, successful marketing (Kmart events), and the collectors of the line in general.

Although this is a pointless paragraph in relation to the rest of the discussion, but do take account of how since the first 4 Cars Take Flight Cars were made in Thailand, nobody knew about them until they were actually released. The Nasca Truck, however, was made in China and was already leaked by mydogcallzero months before the Take Flight line was released. So that means that there are either no Cars backdoor buyers in Thailand or there are a few more locks on the Thailand backdoor than on China's.

yes i think Thailand has a better bolt on their backdoor than they have in China lol

[wintermelon]

This is my understanding...

Backdoor Disney Cars = Stolen goods (example those MaMa on Ebay). Stolen to me doesn't mean is counterfeit or fake.
However, is more about whether you going to support it or not?

Fake = Country Mcqueen fake because they actually steal Disney design and came out something of their own in Mattel scale. From what i was told they even did the mold for the front piece.

Counterfeit = imitation of the real deal. There are some counterfeit cars out there. They look like Mattel's car and even have packaging. I guess some of you are aware of the carded crew chief fillmore singles. I think Cars is still ok but not the case for Thomas diecast line.

Custom = Red Ransburg, yellow truck from mydogcallzero , cowboy hat flik, apple cars, haulers. (Agree with GotFrank)

Fillmore1234, for some reason a few of the Chinese seller i know is selling Autonaut Mcqueen and recently i have seen some Chinese sellers (not on Ebay) selling Planes diecast (not the pitty). Didn't Planes rumour to be Made in Thailand then how did those Planes diecast end up being at the Chinese hand? Puzzle puzzle..?!?!?!?! I believe there should be some backdoor stuff from Thailand and maybe they are not aware of the Cars market can be this crazy or workers there are happy and content.

To make things worst, how about those packaged cars?? Any input?

This is my opinion, i doubt Mattel actually care about us as community. If they would really want to milk us there are many ways instead of doing those multipack and superchase deal.

I think the real problem here is Mattel is a big Mess internally, that explains why all those Super Chase went to the online retailers not retailers. As for what is coming, i believe they had already decided that like 6-10 months before their new calendar starts. I believe Mattel already have plans for 2014. If not how are they going to get everything approved, produce, packaged and shipped in time??

Big corporation only care about their stock holders and board of directors. Why would they care about us? Didn't EA being voted as one of the worst company in USA? EA is just a prime example of big corporation which doesn't care about their consumers. They will just do what they want to make sure their figure looks good! Look at what a mess SimCity is. I ain't talking about the server issues/RCI but the game is full of bugs. I believe the game could be better if more time was given to the dev. for beta test. Some of those bugs could easily being fixed and avoided with a few lines of codes or proper debugging.

[lovemini]

well, the only member lives in China write some here, hope can help you know current China a little more. Know more, then you can understand more.
In fact, I think this topic no relation to cars collection.

1) China changes quickly. china in 10 years ago has quiet diffrent to current china.

2) No Chinese like fake one too, I should say fake product brings big trouble to Chinese people. I do not know whose resposibility that is, but most of Chinese do not like fake one and will not purchse fake one.

3) All the ladies's bags round me are not fake one, 50% of them are from US and UK, since price of those bags are only 1/2 to 2/3 in US, UK even HongKong. What kind of people will purchase fake LV ? I think my grandma will buy, since LV bag is no difference to a bag without any band to her, she just wants buy a $10 bag.
There is a market in Shanghai, full of fake watches, bags, glasses. but all the customer are foreigner. My wife and I always do not understand why they will buy those products. by the way, the only fake apple product can use found there. No chinese will purchase them, even my grandma.

4) No fake iphone, ipad and other apple product here. people here need not purchase a fake apple product, many other cheap similar product you can found here. If we want purchase a cheap pad, we can select another band you never know, but almost no one will purchase a fake apple ipad. Other stange thing is I think 30%-40% apple product are purchased from US, HongKong and other country, not from China. Why? it is 80% price in HongKong and 75% price in the US. My ipad is from HongKong, since I wait 4 months after Ipad 3 is released in US, Apple store in china still does not sell it, so I have no choice to purchase oversea. if it sells, I will purchse here even I can save 20% to 25% money.

5) To DVD, no answer here, and should say no choice for me. here is no apple TV, even has not youtube. Stores has not those DVDs. for example, if my son want to watch cars, how can I let him watch the movie. if I can pay $5 on iTurn or apple TV to let my son watch Car, I will be happy to do this. A cup of starbucks coffee is $5 here, so who cares a cup of coffee. the issue here is that we cannot find a source to watch Cars. well, I can order from amazon US, but DVD has region code, so still cannot watch. amazon US only ship books and DVDs to China. so, what can you do if you are here, purchase one DVD without copy right with $3 or do not watch movie? I took my son to cinema to watch the movie we like, but we cannot go to there everyday.

6) I do not know all the things about China, just can say something I know. too many people here. Every year, there is big change here, no one will think china is second biggest market of apple product 5 years ago. I only saw 2 Mac five years ago, now, apple product is everywhere, 1/4 people here use iphone. most of my friends has more than one ipad in a family.

back to cars,

7) If people here can buy a card car with $5, no one will buy a loose one by $8. That is Mattel distribution problem. In TRU of biggest city of China, you only can buy Mater and McQueen released in 2010 with $11. You can buy single cars in Germany, you can buy mega size from singaproe. But most of them are never shown in China stores. You can get a 10-20 cars list of cars, which are never show in US. but I can get a 10-20 cars list, which are only shown in China. That is the reason why so few chinese collector here.

8) Most of people in China buy some cars just for kids, they have not and need not enough knowledge of distiguish a car is a loose one from card or a loose one from backdoor. How many people in this world can judge a real apple race, which is 1/1000. Also, iApple racer is no difference to other racers in their eyes, only apple logo is special. Most of mattel car has not a chinese name.

8) 95% mattel disney cars are made in China. so mattel disney cars == made in China, I cannot find the relation between the backdoor and china. if have, then, I think there are many relation between backdoor and US.

[lovemini]

I remember this topic is discussed in CTT already before, why do we need to discuss this again? if really want to do something to help collectors, Mattel should study Lego, I can buy mosf of Lego sets here, so my son can play them, even Lego are never made in China.

[jonj]

Lovemini is right, this thread should not be kept open and certainly not having to defend himself over this. People on this site me included have purchased back door cars and there for should not be making a big thing about them. I have many cars from eBay, have they come from china? Yes! do I think there wrong to own? No! Without them I would not have the single items that I have.

We speak about mattel not caring or acting on these cars being sold via back door methods, if you think about it, these cars are sold at retail for an average $4 in the states and a bit more in Europe, to a global company like mattel do you really think they would miss a few $$$ worth of cars when they are having there products marketed for free across the world, not really! very clever from there point of view.

[PopeMobile]

But I will say that Mattel has got to know something about how there have always been backdoor Cars leaking out from China. If it was actually 'stealing', then Mattel would have fixed that problem a long time ago.

Mattel doesn't control the factories - sure they agree to deals with the Chinese to make their products there and have rules and so forth but they can't police the backdoor stuff unless the government there cracks down and stops it which is not the case. Mattel probably just considers backdoors to be 'leakage' and the price of doing business. They need to keep production in China due to the lower labor cost model. So it's just part of doing business.

[cac1959]

As one of the site administrators, I thank everyone for your comments... and I am closing this thread...